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Machinery Colour Register

Printed From: VHGMC
Category: The Main Forum Area
Forum Name: General talk and discussion
Forum Discription: Equipment, Shows, Problems, talk about them all here.
URL: http://www.tractorbox.co.uk/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4447
Printed Date: 18 Apr 2019 at 2:14pm


Topic: Machinery Colour Register
Posted By: simar kid
Subject: Machinery Colour Register
Date Posted: 14 May 2011 at 7:37pm
Just recently i have talked with others about original paint colours of our restorations.and it has come out that some have gone to great lengths to get matches on original colours. what are the forum members views on making a register for future enthousiasts ?

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop



Replies:
Posted By: pmackellow
Date Posted: 14 May 2011 at 7:39pm
Thats a great idea, listing an exact colour and a "nearest match" would be ideal.

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Collector of Tarpen, Wheelhorse, International Cub Cadet, Landmaster, Cooper Stewart, Farmfitters, Jobber, Jalo, Ro-lo, Sisis and literature


Posted By: enginear
Date Posted: 14 May 2011 at 8:57pm
If this idea is going to work then we need to procure the same make and type of paint it would be nice if a reputable paint manufacture would keep a list of makes and colours and supply us which they could do at a slightly reduced cost if we all purchased the paint from them.

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simple


Posted By: Jimmy C
Date Posted: 14 May 2011 at 9:36pm
That's a very good idea John, You would first need to approach admin if it's admin who are to keep such a recorded log. 

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Regards, Jim.


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 14 May 2011 at 9:41pm
hi jimmy. its just an idea at the moment,but when admin read this topic they might take it on as an extra in archives

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: Jimmy C
Date Posted: 14 May 2011 at 9:47pm
I hope so John, The type of paint is owners discretion but the real pain in the butt is getting the right colour to begin with, Well done for thinking of the idea.

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Regards, Jim.


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 9:40am
just been thinking about what engineer said.if you have the paint code,you can get the paint from any reputable paint mixer. if you get the international ral code for it any one in the world can mix it. seems an easier way to be less of a risk incase the appointed supplier goes bust.

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: Sweeneytodd
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 10:59am
 I totally agree with all thats been said,because its so discouraging  when some individuals come up and say' s "That not the right colour for this machine", especially as they've no idea whats already involved into getting the said machine to  the condition that its at right now when it was only fit for "scrap" a while ago. DaveBig%20smile

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Its not true*** you can get somethings for nothing (if you look hard enough )


Posted By: series1gem
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 11:09am
The only problem i can see is that manufacturers often changed the shade part way through production so there will allways be controversy and some smart a**e comming up to you saying thats the wrong colour etc.

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If it isnt orange it isnt a rotavator


Posted By: Sweeneytodd
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 11:41am
Thats true gareth we used to find  at work especially with the older ransomes machines  colour "Green"., and Iseki "Blue".

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Its not true*** you can get somethings for nothing (if you look hard enough )


Posted By: farmers boy 2
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 12:11pm
Hi there i guess that any such info should only be veiwed as a guide. maybe we could look into not just a colours page but more of a specification guide for each machine type covering all types of info from colours to timing, modern or available spark plugs, oils etc
The only draw back would be that it would need to be on a read only bases, up dated by the admin team and probarly in the members area but if you guys think this is ok then i will take it to the rest of the team for there thoughts

but at the moment its time for your comments.   

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Kim. He's not a newbie, just a well preserved secondhand model


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 1:24pm
hi kim.many of the comments support some sort of a guide and with the addition of engine specs it will be a bonus to all and future budding collectors. also if we can do something like this and add original oil specs and modern equivilants

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: farmers boy 2
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 1:51pm
just to put it in perspective so far only 6 different folk have replied, im hoping for a wider response say 15 to 20 different folk.
ps im not against the idea, in fact this would be a good addition, but it is a large undertaking and would need careful planning and managing so before we jump in with both feet it would be good to see more responses.

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Kim. He's not a newbie, just a well preserved secondhand model


Posted By: Charlie
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 5:08pm
A good idea, but remembering that not all club members access the forum so it would also need to be available in paper form.
It might be worth including a note stating how the colour was matched, eg electronically scanned from an original piece not normally exposed to sun, or best match by eye.
If some clever clogs does say' thats not the right colour' you can always tell them you like it that colour.


Posted By: Sweeneytodd
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 6:28pm

Charlie ,That is so true, but when I showed someone  my latest machine an Auto-Culto Junior  and on its strip down the original yellow had been painted in  what looks like a "Hammerite Blue" .so which is the right colour. Dave



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Its not true*** you can get somethings for nothing (if you look hard enough )


Posted By: jimbo
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 8:48pm
Hi we have just done an auto culto junior and found the colours from original pieces on the machine which were red and green. Taking the colour debate we did a simar 56a a while back, we took some pieces that had not been affected by the sun to our local paint supplier where we did a colour match by eye with the colour charts and painted it that colour green, almost a lime green as was commented about on this forum. But the point was we had done our best to match it with the original and we were happy and still are, so hard luck to any that dont like it.


Posted By: pmackellow
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 9:21pm
If a colour guide gets established on here, theres nothing to stop a printed copy appearing in The Cultivator, then all the members see it...

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Collector of Tarpen, Wheelhorse, International Cub Cadet, Landmaster, Cooper Stewart, Farmfitters, Jobber, Jalo, Ro-lo, Sisis and literature


Posted By: TITCH
Date Posted: 15 May 2011 at 10:34pm
I think Johns idea is a good idea too, I'm all for it. In fact I might be interested helping to compile something if required.
 
It could be encouraging to others to join up too if they can get access to the likes of it via here.
 
Keep it simple, imformative and as true to life as is humanly possible??
 
Titch


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Restorations Final Touch!


Posted By: series1gem
Date Posted: 16 May 2011 at 10:15pm
i really feel the argument that not everybody has access to the internet no longer holds any water, true some may not want to have access to the internet but thats their hard luck, anyone can go to the libary and use it free or surely within a stones throw there is a neighbour or friend in this day and age with the net. I live in a remotish villiage yet when i turn my wifi i'm usually picking up about 7 signals, (3 of which arent secure and anyone can access them,) My phone has also got reasonable internet access now so surely if people want to find out information that will benifit them then accept that the internet is the way the world is heading, weather or not thats a good thing is another matter...

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If it isnt orange it isnt a rotavator


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 17 May 2011 at 6:57pm
Originally posted by Sweeneytodd

Charlie ,That is so true, but when I showed someone  my latest machine an Auto-Culto Junior  and on its strip down the original yellow had been painted in  what looks like a "Hammerite Blue" .so which is the right colour. Dave

hi dave maybe the idea of a record of colours,would answer your question to charlie. and set the colours in stone so there was no confusion.

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: farmers boy 2
Date Posted: 25 May 2011 at 10:08pm
simar kid its here !!! just not been posted on recently so on the next page !!!


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Kim. He's not a newbie, just a well preserved secondhand model


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 25 May 2011 at 10:13pm

oops i was getting in a panic . many thanks kim i will have to look harder.can my enquiry be deleted .thanks.



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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: Colin Jacobs
Date Posted: 29 May 2011 at 4:34pm
I use Witham oil and paint co  in Lowestoft Suffolk I take the item with me and they scan the item and I get an exact match 


Posted By: thorin7860
Date Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 8:30pm
s i g  is right i'm very suprised that the original ral colour is not available for our machinery and then everyone would be able to paint their machines to match original colour scheme found this on the tinternet(((  http://www.ralcolor.com/  )))  gives a good idea of where to start looking


Posted By: thorin7860
Date Posted: 08 Jun 2011 at 9:51pm
just a thought when was the system of ral colours devised,, would it have been around when the majority of our older machines were manufactured and did howard ,, mayfield ,trusty ,, simar , have pretty names for their colours or was it just bog standard orange , blue , green and red


Posted By: Simar 56a
Date Posted: 19 Jun 2011 at 4:58pm
Hi SK, somewhere i'm sure i saw a list of RAL colours by you for these 56a's can you let me have them for both red and green please.
 
Peter


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" i broke it again, damn damn damn"


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 19 Jun 2011 at 7:05pm
hello. paint colours and codes as requested.....LEAF GREEN  RAL 6002  SIGNAL RED   RAL 3001     these colours are the ones i used the paint was a polyurethene brushing type.  can brush and also spray with this type. thanks for enquiring

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: pauly pd
Date Posted: 23 Jun 2011 at 7:29am
i think a colour register is a great idea together with  sourcing  info, this is a fairly new hobby for me so all the  help i can get is good.On this subject any one know the colour of the Rowtrac 5,  most of my paint is quite faded,
Paul


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merry merry tiller !


Posted By: AlexB
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2011 at 8:30am
My 2d worth; a great idea, especially if you can get RAL or BS numbers, as said above, colour is very subjective and the scanners are a bit variable to say the least.
My experience with landrovers is that paint shades did change a bit as time went on, not all have RAL or BS numbers and a growing number of folk recommend and use the Paintman over Hull way.
Continuing the land Rover theme - a great debate has been had regarding RAF blue and it is difficult to get a definitive answer to what pastel green is.
Being colour blind, I have to rely on RAL or BS, or scanning and much prefer the former.
Great idea, with the caveats mentioned by others, above


Posted By: fenman67
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2011 at 12:46pm
i think this would be relly useful
If some clever clogs does say' thats not the right colour' you can always tell them it was the only colour in the tin so there


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2011 at 6:38pm
well guys this idea came about because there where that many colours flying around that it was about time we started to put the uncertanty into perspective.farmers bouy was waiting to see what response would come of this debate before he acted on a register.rightly so,but now i am confident that there is a need and maybe now he will activate his strategy.

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: farmers boy 2
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2011 at 6:40pm
having looked through at this time ten different folk have posted positively on this subject and four neutral or negative comments have been made, although it not been a particularly well supported topic i do also feel that some kind of spec sheet type data reference would be very helpful to all. I still feel that it should indeed contain more detail than just the colour/s.
i think we could be looking at things like
engine
oil type
plug type
colour/s
fuel type/ and mix if 2 stroke

and all info should be verified in some way

responses please



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Kim. He's not a newbie, just a well preserved secondhand model


Posted By: Charlie
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2011 at 8:18pm
Engine, oil and plug should be verified from original documentation with known source of info for alternatives.
Colour would have to be a colour match from an unrestored machine with original paintwork, ideally digitally matched, I would suggest.


Posted By: will_haggle
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2011 at 8:28pm
You'd think that by the 1960's a firm like Wolseley would have had the red of the Merry Tiller pretty well nailed, but the bits I display are all different colours, so I've bought a pot of Russian red which will probably average out between the lot!.........

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6 months ago I couldn't even spell engineer - now I are one
Calne, North Wiltshire...


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2011 at 8:28pm
yes i am in favour of this, it may be possible to add tyre size or wheel rim size as well.as over the years if they are swapped about for faster gearing the new owner may not be aware of this

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: Phil Somers
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2012 at 10:12am
What happened to this idea, or have I missed something, in that case I'm sorry.
 
I have a few different machines now in various paints and I would also like to return to the original oils and plus if possible.
 
Would it be possible for a few stickys to be posted one for each type of machine and once we have the definitive colours and other bits just fix them on the forum.
Sorry if this is a mega job for the admin team.
 
Phil 


Posted By: Charlie
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2012 at 11:41am
No definitive answer was given. This is all a very good idea but will need someone (or a team) to co-ordinate and verify data. We are still waiting for volunteers to form a queue.
Another consideration is should the information be kept in the members only section, another benefit of joining the VHGMC rather than just the forum.


Posted By: Phil Somers
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2012 at 2:12pm
Looks like someone needs to make a decision?
 
What about a new heading in the Club forum, every machine has an entry or thread. Once all the contributors have agreed on the information entered into each thread/machine spec the threads can be closed down and made into information stickys.
We could still have the "Machine Specification" forum open to new entries but the stickys can only be altered by the admin team with agreement from contributing members.
This way the team to organise it are the members who contribute, with admin just finalising the thread once contributors have agreed. 
 
Sorry don't know if this can be done this way?
 
Phil 


Posted By: Phil Somers
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2012 at 2:56pm
What about a set stencil that we must stick to e.g.
 

Machine Specification Stencil.

 

Machine Type                          ---------------------

Engine Make/Model                 ---------------------

Engine size/bore                        ---------------------

Valve gap setting                      ---------------------

Cylinder Head  Torque             ---------------------

Spark plug                                ---------------------

Engine colour                            ---------------------

Body colour                             ---------------------

Two tone                                  ---------------------

Wheel size                                ---------------------



Posted By: Charlie
Date Posted: 01 May 2012 at 8:28am
We will also need to have a paper copy available for club members that do not use the forum (the majority).
I will use the template and put a short article in the next issue of The Cultivator requesting information.


Posted By: Phil Somers
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 11:33am
Just before you do Charlie, does anyone want to include anything else on the stencil?
 
Come on everyone lets put this one to bed and it will give us a good reference thread.
 
Phil


Posted By: Hillsider
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 8:47pm
Originally posted by Dididothat

Just before you do Charlie, does anyone want to include anything else on the stencil?

Come on everyone lets put this one to bed and it will give us a good reference thread.


Phil


How about adding the years of manufacture to give an idea of the age range of the machine where this is known. Also in the case of an engine the idling and maximum revs would be helpful.
Ray.


Posted By: simar kid
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 8:57pm
yes i would like to say that if it is a two stroke can the correct petrol oil ratio be included for the guidence of others   not only now,but for future generations.

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Not sure whats wrong. i think we will let it develop


Posted By: Phil Somers
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 9:41am

Machine Specification Stencil.

 

Machine Type  and Age           ---------------------

Engine Make/Model                 ---------------------

Two Stroke oil mix                   ---------------------

Engine size/bore                        ---------------------

Engine Idle speed (revs)            ---------------------

Engine Max speed (revs)          ---------------------

Valve gap setting                      ---------------------

Cylinder Head  Torque             ---------------------

Spark plug and gap                   ---------------------

Points gap                                ---------------------

Engine colour                            ---------------------

Body colour                             ---------------------

Two tone                                  ---------------------

Wheel size                                ---------------------

 
Anything else anyone can think of?


Posted By: Charlie
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 10:15am
I thought this was going to be a 'machinery colour' register. It is turning into a full machine spec reference. Is this what we want/need? Most of the tech stuff is listed in machine/engine manuals. It is things like colour that are not given and are needed. Just a thought.


Posted By: Phil Somers
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 12:23pm
When you look back through the posts Charlie, when some gets a machine these are always questions that they ask?


Posted By: alan
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 7:35pm

Hello Everyone.

I've read the comments on this thread over the past few days.

In answer to "When you look back through the posts Charlie, when some gets a machine these are always questions that they ask?" my reply is nope...

They ask:

"Has anyone else got a machine like this?"
"What is it?"
"How old is it?"
"How do I get it running?"

This is then followed by a discussion (and healthy arguments!)between various members about what should or shouldn't be done to spring the machine back into life. The reason there is a thread or discussion is because it invariably turns out that every machine is (or appears to be) different from the one it sat next to on the production line!

Alan













Posted By: vegikev
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 10:42pm
[QUOTE=Sweeneytodd]

Charlie ,That is so true, but when I showed someone  my latest machine an Auto-Culto Junior  and on its strip down the original yellow had been painted in  what looks like a "Hammerite Blue" .so which is the right colour. Dave

hi charlie mine is mainly green over yellow but the fuel tank and rotavator both have traces of a bluey/green hamerite looking paint


Posted By: Charlie
Date Posted: 04 May 2012 at 8:39am
My point is technical information such as valve clearances etc can usually be found in the appropriate manual. Within the club and this forum, members have a vast amount of relevant literature and can often supply a copy for a small fee or even free. The prompt replies given to questions of this nature illustrate this.
The one bit of information not contained in any of the available literature is the colour. Hence the need for some sort of reference document for colours.


Posted By: Hillsider
Date Posted: 04 May 2012 at 12:31pm
Originally posted by Charlie

My point is technical information such as valve clearances etc can usually be found in the appropriate manual. Within the club and this forum, members have a vast amount of relevant literature and can often supply a copy for a small fee or even free. The prompt replies given to questions of this nature illustrate this.
The one bit of information not contained in any of the available literature is the colour. Hence the need for some sort of reference document for colours.


Upon reflection I think Charlie is correct in his comments, what started out as a request for a simple colour reference has grown like topsy into a full blown data sheet. It may well be that there is a place for this in the club documents for members to download as a template if they need to but re the original question of providing a colour reference it may be better to go back to basics and keep it simple.
Ray.



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